Brake Swap

[Twisted_Steel]

When I get all my little duckies in a row (soon I hope), I will do a Crown Vic front suspension swap. I would love to use my 15" Keystone Raider rims from the mid 70's. They are great looking wheels, just need to be rechromed. I've seen where guys have swapped out calipers and rotors from Corvettes and such to fit their particular application. It's easy to assume that the rim size is 16" or bigger.
The reason I want to stay with the CV swap is I found a complete P71 front end for $75.00
Has anyone out there found a rotor/caliper combo that fits a CV suspension where 15" wheels can be used?
Can a spacer to change the lug pattern from the CV rotor to the factory truck pattern be used to offset the wheels to clear the CV calipers?

Thanks in advance.

[JoshT]

Keystone Raiders, is it safe to assume that those are allowed wheels?

What year P71 front end?

[Twisted_Steel]

Best way to describe them without a pic is like a chrome Nascar wheel. Small square holes in the dish and each spoke has a roll in the center. When new, they sparkled like diamonds when reflecting off glass store fronts.
As far as the year, one I looked at with a missing hub was an 03 the other was an 06. Both were police cars.
Allowed as in?????

[DuckRyder]

I think he means “alloy” and the auto correct got him.

Don’t Keystone Raiders look basically like Cragar SS?

Keystone Klassic, Cragar SS and Centerline Auto Drag were the go to wheels back in the day...

[Twisted_Steel]

No. These aren't the standard Keystone or Cragar style mags. These are more like the Gold Nugget wheels but with square holes. I'll try to get a pic of them tomorrow when I head over to the old home place.

[Twisted_Steel]

Keystone Raiders, is it safe to assume that those are allowed wheels?

What year P71 front end?

They are steel wheels. Not alloy.

[JoshT]

I think he means “alloy” and the auto correct got him.

Was supposed to say alloy. Why/how that got changed to allowed I have no idea, and I'm usually better about proofing my posts.

Reason I ask is usually steel wheels offer a little more brake clearance than the same size alloy wheel and earlier Vics had front brakes.

A 15" wheel would definitely fit on 97 and earlier. 98 and later came with minumum 16" standard from the factory. The issue is clearance to the brake caliper. Couldn't find references of people getting a 15" on 98 and later without grinding the caliper, but most of those were also probably referring to a 15" alloy wheel instead of steel. It's entirely possible that the steel 15" will fit where the alloy 15" won't, it's also possible that the different backspacing on these truck wheels vs a Crown Vic wheels backspacing will provide clearance.

From my understanding you'll also have to run wheel adapters to keep your wheels. Crown Vic uses 5x4.5 while F-100 uses 5x5.5. To get that change in lug pattern the adapter will also have to act as a spacer. Spacer combined with backspacing difference could be the key to getting a 15" on a later model.

Just too many variables to say for certain without having both there to measure and/or test fit.

[JoshT]

I could be 100% wrong here, but...

Actually after thinking about it, your wheels might not fit under the truck with a CV suspension anyway. 03-10 CV WMS (wheel mounting surface) width is several inches wider than the trucks width. That added width plus the spacer needed to adapt bolt patterns will make the front suspension much wider than stock.

If you can find an 02 or earlier they are a few inches narrower and a 97 or earlier will definitely fit your 15s. That said the spacers required to fit your wheels may still push them too far outside the body.

I'm going purely of thoughts and quick Google searching here. I've looked into Crown Vics a bit in the past because I've considered buying one, I haven't yet. I've looked into Crown Vic wheels in the past because I was considering some for a Ranger, went with Mach 1s instead. I've looked at many F-100
Crown Vic suspension swaps because the interest me, but I've got a 4x4 and not considering it myself. This is something that'll really take time with the components and tape measure to figure out.

Should you decide your wheels will not work and choose go ahead with the swap, it's not the end of the world. If you are going to have to get wheels anyway I'd recommend sticking with the 03+ CV suspension. A nice 16" (or even 17") wheel with the right rubber does not look out of place on these trucks, in fact it can look really good. Not that much of a stretch either considering that these things came with a 16.5" wheel from the factory. There's a lot more good and affordable rubber in the bigger wheel sizes, that was actually one of the deciding factors in stepping my own 4x4 F-100 up to a 16" wheel. You could also find cheap factory wheels with a 5x4.5" lug pattern that fit the front without a spacer and look good on the truck. Sure that would mean running a wheel adapter/spacer on the rear axle, but that can be a good excuse to make the rear track width match the front. IMO a wider rear track width really changes the look of these trucks for the better.

[jamesdfo]

Josh: You mention pre '03 CV front ends, bad news is, on the earlier cars, the crossmember is steel, and is a welded member of the frame, not a bolt-in deal like the aluminum crossmember used in the '03 and up cars............


.....and to the OP, whatever $$ you spend to make the wheels you have fit will be exponentially more than it will cost you to just buy wheels that actually fit, and unless you buy some high end calipers, etc to go with your new smaller dia rotors, you will also be losing front braking power, so ponder on all this before you go ahead and spend a bunch of money:)

James

I could be 100% wrong here, but...

Actually after thinking about it, your wheels might not fit under the truck with a CV suspension anyway. 03-10 CV WMS (wheel mounting surface) width is several inches wider than the trucks width. That added width plus the spacer needed to adapt bolt patterns will make the front suspension much wider than stock.

If you can find an 02 or earlier they are a few inches narrower and a 97 or earlier will definitely fit your 15s. That said the spacers required to fit your wheels may still push them too far outside the body.

I'm going purely of thoughts and quick Google searching here. I've looked into Crown Vics a bit in the past because I've considered buying one, I haven't yet. I've looked into Crown Vic wheels in the past because I was considering some for a Ranger, went with Mach 1s instead. I've looked at many F-100
Crown Vic suspension swaps because the interest me, but I've got a 4x4 and not considering it myself. This is something that'll really take time with the components and tape measure to figure out.

Should you decide your wheels will not work and choose go ahead with the swap, it's not the end of the world. If you are going to have to get wheels anyway I'd recommend sticking with the 03+ CV suspension. A nice 16" (or even 17") wheel with the right rubber does not look out of place on these trucks, in fact it can look really good. Not that much of a stretch either considering that these things came with a 16.5" wheel from the factory. There's a lot more good and affordable rubber in the bigger wheel sizes, that was actually one of the deciding factors in stepping my own 4x4 F-100 up to a 16" wheel. You could also find cheap factory wheels with a 5x4.5" lug pattern that fit the front without a spacer and look good on the truck. Sure that would mean running a wheel adapter/spacer on the rear axle, but that can be a good excuse to make the rear track width match the front. IMO a wider rear track width really changes the look of these trucks for the better.

[JoshT]

Got it. Was not aware of that. As mentioned I've only read about the swap, not looked into it myself.

[Aerocoupe]

So the biggest issue is bolt pattern. CV bolt pattern is 5 x 4.5 where our trucks are 5 x 5.5. So if your existing wheels are 5 x 5.5 then they will not fit the CV hubs. Also, I am about 99% sure that 15" wheels will not fit the 03-11 stock CV brakes. You might be able to find a steel wheel that would but I just do not think it is physically possible to fit a 15" wheel over the CV brakes. Ford moved up to 16" wheels with the '03 model to the day they no longer made it. Most of the Lincolns came with 17's as did the CV Sport and the Mercury Marauder came with 18's. Do not forget about the Grand Marquis being a viable parts car as well.

I went through all of this when I got the adapters to run the C5 Vette calipers and 14" GT500 rotors. Being that I was going to order 9" axles I got them with the 5 x 4.5 pattern to match the CV pattern as there is way more wheel selection in this pattern for obvious reasons.